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    OoX vs. MC?
    • An odd thought hit me yesterday, what if the death/survival of OoT Twinrova
      leads to either Minish Cap or Oracle of Ages/Seasons?

      On the AT, OoT Link kills Twinrova, so later on the Oracles are safely
      brought to Hyrule in The Minish Cap.

      On the CT Link didn't kill Twinrova, so their plot to revive Ganon by
      making use of Veran and Onox creates difficulties in bringing the
      Oracles safely to Hyrule. Link kills Veran, Onox and Twinrova thus making
      it safe for the Oracles to remain in Holodrum and Labrynna.

      AT: OoT...MC
      CT: OoT...OoX

      P.S. One thing wasn't clear in the credits. Do Ralph & Nayru start a family
      and raise a bunch of kids (Nayru seems to be carrying groceries)? Or are
      the village children just teasing them because they are an "item"?

      (I still don't like an AT placement of MC, but I kind of like this theory)
    • Oracles and Four Swords Advetnures have to fall on the same timeline, with the Oracles going before it. In the Oracles, Ganon is sealed within the Trident. During Four Swords Adventures, Ganon is reincarnated because his spirit was already sealed with the Trident before (a story connection placing Four Sword/Advetnures after the Oracles).

      Because The Minish Cap, the preuel the Four Swords Advetnures, has literal descendents of the Oracle females come to Hyrule, that also places the Oracles on the same timeline and before the Four Sword games. There is a theory that the Oracle descendents moved to Hyrule, and them doing that led to the existence of the use of shrine maidens in the Four Swords Advetnures era. Don't ask how- - iread it a while ago.

      There is also reason to believe that Holdrum and Labrynna were founded during and after The Wind Waker era when islands began to expand and big enough for a country, based on one of the Tingle games, which references the events of the Oracles in a clearly post-flood world.
      [COLOR="Black"]Personal Timeline Information[/COLOR]

      [COLOR="DarkGreen"]Child Timeline:[/COLOR] [COLOR="Teal"]OoT/MM - TP - ALttP/LA[/COLOR]
      [COLOR="DarkGreen"]Adult Timeline:[/COLOR] [COLOR="Teal"]OoT - tWW/PH - FPTRR - LoZ/AoL - OoA/OoS - tMC - FS/FSA[/COLOR]


      *Prone to frequent change
      * [___] = not sure of exact timeline placment
      *Spin-offs included

      [COLOR="DarkGreen"]PotentCove[/COLOR]
      I am [COLOR="RoyalBlue"]Potent[/COLOR], he is [COLOR="DarkRed"]Cove[/COLOR].

      LupusX;3066177 wrote:

      Some people listen do Heavy Metal, some prefer classical music, I listen to Zelda.
    • Well, OoX after OoT in the CT seems logical, but where do you place them? Before or after TP?

      And wasn't Twinrova trying to revive Ganon in OoX? Why they do such a thing if he is encaged in Arbiter's Ground?

      Or if OoX is placed after TP, why Twinrova wasn't mentioned in the game? Both are a powerful and allies to Ganny.
      [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
      Awsome sig is awsome...
      Thank to Diaz in La Tienda de Negro for the amazing work :D

      We are living in a post-Zelda Timeline world. Isn't that scary? :P
    • There is also a picture of what appears to be Twinrova hidden deep witin the Arbiter's Grounds, which just so happens to be where Ganondorf was executed. Judging by the fact that her picture is displayed deep within the grounds, an execution ground, it seems to hint that she would have also been executed for being a strong ally of Ganondorf.
      [COLOR="Black"]Personal Timeline Information[/COLOR]

      [COLOR="DarkGreen"]Child Timeline:[/COLOR] [COLOR="Teal"]OoT/MM - TP - ALttP/LA[/COLOR]
      [COLOR="DarkGreen"]Adult Timeline:[/COLOR] [COLOR="Teal"]OoT - tWW/PH - FPTRR - LoZ/AoL - OoA/OoS - tMC - FS/FSA[/COLOR]


      *Prone to frequent change
      * [___] = not sure of exact timeline placment
      *Spin-offs included

      [COLOR="DarkGreen"]PotentCove[/COLOR]
      I am [COLOR="RoyalBlue"]Potent[/COLOR], he is [COLOR="DarkRed"]Cove[/COLOR].

      LupusX;3066177 wrote:

      Some people listen do Heavy Metal, some prefer classical music, I listen to Zelda.
    • As for the CT OoX, it would have to be after Ganon returned from the Twilight Realm in TP.
      Before TP, Ganondorf would not have a rep as the "king of evil" which is how OoX Twinrova
      refer to Ganon. TP Ganondorf seems to be doing fine without Twinrova's aid, but if they
      wanted to revive Ganon he would have to die, so OoX still wouldn't come between OoT and TP.

      I prefer to think that Twinrova revives FSA/ALttP Ganon, which I place after TP on the CT.
      Because FSA/ALttP Ganon is an evil king of darkness and explains the OoX Trident.

      That's why my CT goes OoT/MM...TP...FSA...ALttP...OoX

      Twinrova living from OoT to OoX is admittedly a long haul...I don't know how much over
      400 years they can survive.

      The post was edited 3 times, last by Cukeman ().

    • Potent Col wrote:

      Oracles and Four Swords Advetnures have to fall on the same timeline, with the Oracles going before it. In the Oracles, Ganon is sealed within the Trident.


      What? Ganon was never sealed in the trident in OoX.

      「聖なるイケニエ」ゼルダを よりしろに ガノンのタマシイを よびよせれば かんせいじゃ! われらが じきじきに じごくへ おくってくれるわ!
      When we sacrifice Zelda, the “Holy Sacrifice”, and summon Ganon’s spirit into the yorishiro, it will be complete! We will personally send you to hell!
      Our sacrifice of Zelda is all that remains! When we call Ganon's spirit into the vessel, it will be done! You can't stop us! Prepare to meet your doom!


      The "vessel" is Zelda herself, not the Trident.

      During Four Swords Adventures, Ganon is reincarnated because his spirit was already sealed with the Trident before (a story connection placing Four Sword/Advetnures after the Oracles)


      No, there was no spirit in the trident according to the Japanese version.

      ジャキ… 魔の邪器(じゃき) トライデント…?
      Ja-ki… Demon's evil device, the trident…?
      Evil spirit... Spirit of magic? Trident?

      武器の形をした このくぼみ…。
      This indentation is in the shape of a weapon…
      This indentation is in the shape of a weapon.

      ここから そのトライデントを 手に入れた者が …もしや ガノンドロフ…?!
      Don't tell me the person who took this trident from here… was Ganondorf…?!
      Do you think the person who took this trident was... Ganondorf?!?

      グフーとは またちがう 闇の王…!!
      The King of Darkness is not Gufuu…!!
      The King of Darkness is not Vaati?

      そ…、そんな おそろしい男が、いったい今 このハイラルのどこで 何をしていると言うの…!
      S…such a terrible man is actually now somewhere in Hyrule doing something…!
      Does this mean this wicked man is somewhere in Hyrule plotting even now?

      …リンク! 事態は 私たちが考えていた以上に しんこくです! 先を急ぎましょう!
      …Link! The situation is even more serious than we thought! We must hurry!
      Link! The situation is even more desperate than I believed! We must hurry!

      Post by Cukeman ().

      The post was deleted, no further information is available.
    • Potent Col wrote:

      Because The Minish Cap, the preuel the Four Swords Advetnures, has literal descendents of the Oracle females come to Hyrule, that also places the Oracles on the same timeline and before the Four Sword games.


      The Minish Cap only says that the "Minish Cap Oracles" are descended from
      a line of Oracles in Holodrum and Labrynna.

      This does not tell us whether the OoX Oracles were before, during, or after
      The Minish Cap (if OoX and MC are on the same timeline). It only tells us
      that the "Minish Cap Oracles" have a family line.

      If MC and OoX are on separate timeline branches, the MC statement
      simply provides a backdrop of Oracle families for either game.
    • Potent Col wrote:

      There is also a picture of what appears to be Twinrova hidden deep witin the Arbiter's Grounds, which just so happens to be where Ganondorf was executed. Judging by the fact that her picture is displayed deep within the grounds, an execution ground, it seems to hint that she would have also been executed for being a strong ally of Ganondorf.


      They could have done what a lot of old nazi officials did and gone into hiding outside of Hyrule.

      Cukeman wrote:

      Twinrova living from OoT to OoX is admittedly a long haul...I don't know how much over
      400 years they can survive.


      Well, they know how to resurrect the dead maybe they also know how to extend their lives through magical means.
    • Potent Col wrote:

      Oracles and Four Swords Advetnures have to fall on the same timeline, with the Oracles going before it. In the Oracles, Ganon is sealed within the Trident. During Four Swords Adventures, Ganon is reincarnated because his spirit was already sealed with the Trident before (a story connection placing Four Sword/Advetnures after the Oracles).

      Can't the Trident exist on both sides? of the timeline? Perhaps he's sealed in the Trident at some point in both.

      But I don't want to get into that because this isn't about FSA's placement.

      Cukeman wrote:

      Twinrova living from OoT to OoX is admittedly a long haul...I don't know how much over
      400 years they can survive.

      Isn't it also a long haul for them to have survived from OoT to OoX on the adult timeline as well?:P
      Either way, it seems like they've either been resurrected or this is a different Twinrova. (like how some would argue that Ganondorf in FSA is a completely different Ganondorf from OoT, TP and WW)
      [SIZE="1"][FONT="Book Antiqua"]Just dance. It's gonna be okay.[/FONT]
      [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
      [FONT="Georgia"]...And I'm yours. That's why I won't leave you forever.[/FONT][/SIZE]

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Ŧҽҽᶄɑƴ ().

    • Ŧєєķαý wrote:

      Can't the Trident exist on both sides? of the timeline? Perhaps he's sealed in the Trident at some point in both.

      But I don't want to get into that because this isn't about FSA's placement.

      Isn't it also a long haul for them to have survived from OoT to OoX on the adult timeline as well?:P
      Either way, it seems like they've either been resurrected or this is a different Twinrova. (like how some would argue that Ganondorf in FSA is a completely different Ganondorf from OoT, TP and WW)


      If it wasn't for the fact that its origins were explained in Four Sword/Adventures, explaining why he has it in the other Zelda games.
      [COLOR="Black"]Personal Timeline Information[/COLOR]

      [COLOR="DarkGreen"]Child Timeline:[/COLOR] [COLOR="Teal"]OoT/MM - TP - ALttP/LA[/COLOR]
      [COLOR="DarkGreen"]Adult Timeline:[/COLOR] [COLOR="Teal"]OoT - tWW/PH - FPTRR - LoZ/AoL - OoA/OoS - tMC - FS/FSA[/COLOR]


      *Prone to frequent change
      * [___] = not sure of exact timeline placment
      *Spin-offs included

      [COLOR="DarkGreen"]PotentCove[/COLOR]
      I am [COLOR="RoyalBlue"]Potent[/COLOR], he is [COLOR="DarkRed"]Cove[/COLOR].

      LupusX;3066177 wrote:

      Some people listen do Heavy Metal, some prefer classical music, I listen to Zelda.
    • Potent Col wrote:

      If it wasn't for the fact that its origins were explained in Four Sword/Adventures, explaining why he has it in the other Zelda games.

      Yes and no. Some people apply the same argument to Link's hat in TMC (ugh), and that doesn't work out so well.

      But like I said, I didn't want to get into it because the placement of FSA is a whole separate issue.;)
      [SIZE="1"][FONT="Book Antiqua"]Just dance. It's gonna be okay.[/FONT]
      [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
      [FONT="Georgia"]...And I'm yours. That's why I won't leave you forever.[/FONT][/SIZE]
    • Jarsh wrote:


      The "vessel" is Zelda herself, not the Trident.

      I agree that what potent said is speculation and shouldn't be passed as fact like he tried to. I do however think that the japanese version is rather ambigious about what the vessel is. So ambigious the european translaters weren't sure what to make out of it. The french version talks about a corps, hinting that they think the vessel is Zelda, the german version calls the vessel and object. The japanese version is open to interpretation.(i.e. the vessel and the "holy sacrifice" might be two different things. In fact the japanese sentence makes it sound as if they are not the same thing)
      [SIGPIC]http://www.zeldauniverse.net/forums/community-central/124234-the-legend-of-zelda-timeless-haven-zus-official-community-fan-game.html[/SIGPIC]
      NEW Demo! Click here!
    • Ŧєєķαý wrote:

      Yes and no. Some people apply the same argument to Link's hat in TMC (ugh), and that doesn't work out so well.

      But like I said, I didn't want to get into it because the placement of FSA is a whole separate issue.;)


      So what? Twilight Princess Link didn't start out with a hat, either! In Twilight Princess, Link doesn't start with a cap, does that stop it from coming after Ocarina of Time? Nope.

      The Wind Waker Link didn't start out with a cap- it was given to him as a remake of the Hero of Time's clothes and what he wore. The cap doesn't matter. Do you really expect all of these random people to be born with green caps?

      Links are all just random people with little to no relation to each other. Therefore, the hat is invalid. They normally only recive it to mark that they're a hero in honour of the Hero of Time.
      [COLOR="Black"]Personal Timeline Information[/COLOR]

      [COLOR="DarkGreen"]Child Timeline:[/COLOR] [COLOR="Teal"]OoT/MM - TP - ALttP/LA[/COLOR]
      [COLOR="DarkGreen"]Adult Timeline:[/COLOR] [COLOR="Teal"]OoT - tWW/PH - FPTRR - LoZ/AoL - OoA/OoS - tMC - FS/FSA[/COLOR]


      *Prone to frequent change
      * [___] = not sure of exact timeline placment
      *Spin-offs included

      [COLOR="DarkGreen"]PotentCove[/COLOR]
      I am [COLOR="RoyalBlue"]Potent[/COLOR], he is [COLOR="DarkRed"]Cove[/COLOR].

      LupusX;3066177 wrote:

      Some people listen do Heavy Metal, some prefer classical music, I listen to Zelda.
    • bitterlime wrote:

      I agree that what potent said is speculation and shouldn't be passed as fact like he tried to. I do however think that the japanese version is rather ambigious about what the vessel is. So ambigious the european translaters weren't sure what to make out of it. The french version talks about a corps, hinting that they think the vessel is Zelda, the german version calls the vessel and object. The japanese version is open to interpretation.(i.e. the vessel and the "holy sacrifice" might be two different things. In fact the japanese sentence makes it sound as if they are not the same thing)


      Indeed, it is ambiguous in the Japanese version. But, I thought, the Trident is never mentioned in the text at all, so by process of elimination I thought it would have to be Zelda. In that case, I shouldn't pass off my interpretation as fact either, but what do you think the "yorishiro" is?

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Jarsh ().

    • Now that I think about it, is there any indication that the sacrifice is also the vessel? If that were true, then yes, I suppose Zelda would be the vessel. [strike]However why would she become the vessel and not Onox or Veran? Unless only the last sacrifice becomes the vessel?

      I don't know, it actually seems to make more sense if 3 people are sacrificed and then Ganon's soul is put into a completely separate object afterward.[/strike]
      Scratch that. I obviously didn't realize Onox and Veran already lit the flames before they died.
      I'll just go with what bitterlime said :3



      Potent Col: You are completely missing my point:P
      [SIZE="1"][FONT="Book Antiqua"]Just dance. It's gonna be okay.[/FONT]
      [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
      [FONT="Georgia"]...And I'm yours. That's why I won't leave you forever.[/FONT][/SIZE]

      The post was edited 4 times, last by Ŧҽҽᶄɑƴ ().

    • Jarsh wrote:

      Indeed, it is ambiguous in the Japanese version. But, I thought, the Trident is never mentioned in the text at all, so by process of elimination I thought it would have to be Zelda. In that case, I shouldn't pass off my interpretation as fact either, but what do you think the "yorishiro" is?


      Well I personally think that the yorishiro is not Zelda. The wording in the japanese version seems to treat Zelda and the yorishiro as two different things.
      Furthermore persons who are yorishiros are usually refered to with a more specific term "yorimashi". (ALthough they coud still refere to Zelda as a Yorishiro, especially if they mean her corpse. Alternativley yorishiro is still used for persons if the person is treated as low and worthless by the ritual)
      I really don't know what to make out of it, but since the trident never is mentioned I'd say the yorishiro is Zeldas corpse (after all Twinrova uses their corpse as a substitute when Zelda is rescued)
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    • Ŧєєķαý wrote:

      Potent Col: You are completely missing my point:P


      I'm offended... you know my name. Yet, you speak a name of which exists a parallel known as Potent in the theorizing forum, and not that of which is the real person.

      You're missing the point, too- several Links started without caps. :XD:
      Why the hell does the cap matter? Every Link is a random guy living in a random place in Hyrule and becomes a hero on a random point in time. Therefore, why would any of them begin with caps? They all mostly get caps after doing something heroic, and this is a throwback to the Hero of Time, as The Wind Waker makes clear.

      The Ocarina of Time explained the origin of why hero's where a green tunic at all. Tingle refers to Link as a fairy in The Minish Cap, referencing how the Kokiri tunic, which is green, is seen as being assosiated with fairies.

      The origin was explained in Ocarina of Time: the Kokiri Tunic and Kokiri Cap. After that, the Link became famous on both timelines, and so all future heros would wear green tunics an a green cap.
      [COLOR="Black"]Personal Timeline Information[/COLOR]

      [COLOR="DarkGreen"]Child Timeline:[/COLOR] [COLOR="Teal"]OoT/MM - TP - ALttP/LA[/COLOR]
      [COLOR="DarkGreen"]Adult Timeline:[/COLOR] [COLOR="Teal"]OoT - tWW/PH - FPTRR - LoZ/AoL - OoA/OoS - tMC - FS/FSA[/COLOR]


      *Prone to frequent change
      * [___] = not sure of exact timeline placment
      *Spin-offs included

      [COLOR="DarkGreen"]PotentCove[/COLOR]
      I am [COLOR="RoyalBlue"]Potent[/COLOR], he is [COLOR="DarkRed"]Cove[/COLOR].

      LupusX;3066177 wrote:

      Some people listen do Heavy Metal, some prefer classical music, I listen to Zelda.