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    White Nationalist Terrorist Attack in New Zealand
    • He apparently was streaming a video of it all to 8chan too, he was a member there. You know...the same site a video game company recently decided to host an AMA on and some members of the gaming community were defending the actions of cause it was "owning the libs" or whatever the hell. These alt-right segments of the internet are far from just edgy trolls being shitheads "for the memes"; they're literal breeding grounds for murderers, mass shooters, terrorists, pedophiles, and everything else and it's well past time to fucking do something about it.
    • One of the shooters is apparently a white nationalist from Australia, he's not even from New Zealand. Let the irony of this sink in, it's the same people who rail against open borders. He was able to board a commercial airplane and enter NZ and likely without any visa because of freedom of movement for Australians. Not to say New Zealand should end their freedom of movement with Australia, but if you're an avowed white nationalist you probably should be denied entry/deported just like ISIS fighters are automatically denied entry in many (all?) western countries.



      The post was edited 4 times, last by Viajero de la Galaxia ().

    • Viajero de la Galaxia wrote:

      you probably should be denied entry/deported just like ISIS fighters are automatically denied entry in many western countries.
      Unlike Canada where we apparently welcome them back with open arms and give them tons of tax payers money so they can continue to profit while the rest of us non-terrorist Canadians struggle to pay our bills.


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    • Big Daddy Biggles wrote:

      Viajero de la Galaxia wrote:

      you probably should be denied entry/deported just like ISIS fighters are automatically denied entry in many western countries.
      Unlike Canada where we apparently welcome them back with open arms and give them tons of tax payers money so they can continue to profit while the rest of us non-terrorist Canadians struggle to pay our bills.
      I literally searched what you said and it was almost immediately contradicted. And even if that's the case, should the now destitute Syria be in charge of prosecuting these criminals? Or should it be Canada? They are our citizens.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Mozly Alice: I should stop browsing when I'm half asleep ().

      Post by Big Daddy Biggles ().

      This post was deleted by the author themselves: Actually, I don't feel like getting into this. ().
    • This is really bringing back memories and sadness of the Quebec City mosque shooting and will you look at that the Australian shooter is a fan of Trump and called him "a symbol of renewed white identity and common purpose". Bissonette who did the Quebec City terrorist attack also loved Trump.

      Turns out if politicians continue saying that a certain community is a danger and threatening the survival of the majority (usually for cynical political gain instead of genuine concern), eventually some racist asshole in the majority is going to do something about that fake danger. But no I'll be politically correct and say that politicians have no responsibility in this, these shooters lived in a vacuum and nothing they heard from influential people had any effect on them.
    • I don't want to say this is what happens when you drive racists and sexists into underground internet societies, where they can hide and discuss their honest thoughts without judgement, but is it time we created dialogue with the 8channers and the 4channers and bring them out into the light? All this condemnation from behind the safety of our own computer screens has led us to this point.
    • A discussion requires both sides be acting in at least moderately good faith.

      Plus, they aren't being driven away appreciably. They're all over Twitter, and Facebook, and YouTube, and comment sections. There's some things they can't say there, but mostly it's the really extreme stuff.


      I think part of the problem probably is that incredibly insular subcultures are formed, which leads to people outside those cultures only really seeing how bad things are when the members sortie out to attack others, but this isn't new, and I very much doubt it's being caused by a fear of ridicule. Instead it's an active choice by those trying to recruit, one made even easier due to the way large companies automatically filter people into sub-cultures for advertising purposes (suggesting content similar to what they already know you like and hiding stuff they know you won't).


      Like, what sort of dialogue would you have at this point? "I think all [minority group A] should be violently killed!" What can you say to that? "I disagree but I respect your opinion"? Not gonna cut it.


      Edit: So, if dialogue is out, what's left? I dunno. Deplatforming can, in theory, help, but I start to get a little leery of widespread deplatforming campaigns for a variety of reasons. Honestly, I think condemnation is probably the best move. The problem is that you need a critical mass of it, a clear statement from the vast majority of your society that this is not acceptable, before I think it'd be truly effective, and we just...don't have enough people willing to vocally speak out about it. So...I dunno. Be loud if you can, if you can't then work to help others be loud.

      May those who accept their fate be granted happiness;

      Those who defy it, glory!

      The post was edited 1 time, last by John ().

    • urnotlikeme wrote:

      I don't want to say this is what happens when you drive racists and sexists into underground internet societies, where they can hide and discuss their honest thoughts without judgement, but is it time we created dialogue with the 8channers and the 4channers and bring them out into the light? All this condemnation from behind the safety of our own computer screens has led us to this point.
      Underground? /r/The_Donald members cheered this on. This isn't underground anymore. It hasn't been for a long time.
    • Viajero de la Galaxia wrote:

      One of the shooters is apparently a white nationalist from Australia, he's not even from New Zealand. Let the irony of this sink in, it's the same people who rail against open borders. He was able to board a commercial airplane and enter NZ and likely without any visa because of freedom of movement for Australians. Not to say New Zealand should end their freedom of movement with Australia, but if you're an avowed white nationalist you probably should be denied entry/deported just like ISIS fighters are automatically denied entry in many (all?) western countries.
      We are attempting to find logic and rational thinking out of their actions. However the issue is that there is no logic or rationale behind these terrorists. Their ideas are simply rooted in racism which in it of itself is irrational. I also completely agree with what you said last in regards to barring these types of people as well from being allowed in to a country like they do for ISIS fighters.

      I'd call them monsters but the fact of the matter is that these are people, living, breathing, human beings who did this that are among our society that follow horrifying ideologies being bred online alongside the rise of right wing ideas that seem to have sparked since 2016 (even before).

      If you are to go to Foxnews or CNN or even visit their social media reporting on this grave event, you will see sympathizers for the gunmen. You will see comments that include "This is what happens when you allow Muslims in" and "They now have a taste of their own medicine". Granted, any comment section on the internet is feral these days but there exists a lax reaction to this attack in comparison to others. There is a forgetfulness in that Muslims didn't just die that day. No, New Zealanders died that day. Innocent people died that day. A part of humanity died that day.


      Hasan Minhaj said it best on his Twitter today:
      I'm hosting a Mafia game on Zu! It's based on the hit 1992 film, Reservoir Dogs! You should totally sign up and play this totally radtacular game!
      Mafia XX?V?: Reservoir Cats - SIGN UP

      The post was edited 2 times, last by Aquamentus ().

    • Mozly Alice wrote:

      Underground? /r/The_Donald members cheered this on. This isn't underground anymore. It hasn't been for a long time.
      That's pretty underground to me. Prove me wrong by providing proof of one of those r/Donald_Trump or whatever celebrating on public television. Comments are about as underground as it gets: "I get to blare out my opinion without any serious repercussions to my life or my reputation."

      The post was edited 1 time, last by urnotlikeme ().

    • urnotlikeme wrote:

      Mozly Alice wrote:

      Underground? /r/The_Donald members cheered this on. This isn't underground anymore. It hasn't been for a long time.
      That's pretty underground to me. Prove me wrong by providing proof of one of those r/Donald_Trump or whatever celebrating on public television.
      The comment section on News Articles isn't really underground and there exists support for the gunmen.
      I'm hosting a Mafia game on Zu! It's based on the hit 1992 film, Reservoir Dogs! You should totally sign up and play this totally radtacular game!
      Mafia XX?V?: Reservoir Cats - SIGN UP
    • Just because it exists doesn't mean it's not underground. It's underground because no one can simply talk about this on a public forum like a televised debate. Find me the person who is willing to repeat their hateful comment on TV and face the backlash. Good job in one sense for cleaning out the filth from public eye, but now we've funneled the internet trolls into anonymous comments on social media and on underground forums.
    • urnotlikeme wrote:

      I don't want to say this is what happens when you drive racists and sexists into underground internet societies, where they can hide and discuss their honest thoughts without judgement, but is it time we created dialogue with the 8channers and the 4channers and bring them out into the light? All this condemnation from behind the safety of our own computer screens has led us to this point.

      I don't buy that, these white nationalist terrorist attacks became much more frequent specifically because people like Trump have emboldened them. You're using the same argument that a white nationalist on this very forum also used, that the left's condemnation of the far-right is responsible for far-right violence. Law enforcement for too long has tolerated white nationalism and for the most part (especially in the US) is willfully blind to the threat that white nationalists pose to the US, Canada, New Zealand, etc. I see these people as no different than sex offenders and at some point we have to take their threats seriously and use the legal/political system to fight back.



      The post was edited 1 time, last by Viajero de la Galaxia ().

    • urnotlikeme wrote:

      Just because it exists doesn't mean it's not underground. It's underground because no one can simply talk about this on a public forum like a televised debate. Find me the person who is willing to repeat their hateful comment on TV and face the backlash. Good job in one sense for cleaning out the filth from public eye, but now we've funneled the internet trolls into anonymous comments on social media and on underground forums.
      Holy shit, I feel like I'm in the twilight zone. They aren't underground. Molyneux isn't underground. Gavin McInnes isn't fucking underground. Jordan Fucking Peterson isn't underground.