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      * AFTER ALL
      YOU AND I,

      * SO TO BE HERE

      * IS

      WITH YOU.

      * NOW !


      Tweeted by UNDERTALE this afternoon, I can safely say... this is a very important survey program.

      Discuss... but make sure to tag your findings in neat little spoiler tags

      The post was edited 1 time, last by gamtos ().

    • Regarding the ending:

      Regarding some other stuff:
      Display Spoiler
      Regarding some optional items:
      Display Spoiler
      Namely, the KEY and what it UNLOCKS
      Display Spoiler
      I can't beat this guy. Good heavens he's frustrating.

      Regarding some endgame characters:
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      Honestly what was the king protecting?
      Did he really just say that about my mom?
      Looks like in this universe he took over Grillby's spot.
      Asriel is a Yoshi main confirmed. Really figured he'd play someone edgier based on his final Undertale form.
      Seven flowers man reminds me of Greg

      The post was edited 1 time, last by gamtos ().

    • Just finished.

      Jesus fucking christ I was expecting a short demo what is this.

      Display Spoiler


      Display Spoiler

      So we're doing episodic shits now? I'm absolutely fucking in. Or is it just the first chapter of a larger, full game still in progress? I'm absolutely fucking in in either case, so I don't even care, haha.

      I'm assuming this is a prequel, right? Only human, Asriel's brother, completely messed up for some reason. I'm extremely interested already, but at the same time I was a little bit weirded out by the ending considering... I literally didn't do anything "bad" throughout the whole thing and went full-pacifist on the first one... I have a few ideas as to where they're going to go with that, and it's basically completely removed to what my own Undertale experience was like. Feels like they're already imposing a canon to a game that already heavily relied on your own choice, and I'm not sure if I like that. Like, does going for a pacifist run even make any fucking sense now if they're gonna throw that kind of stuff at the end anyway?

      Aaaaaaaanyway, other than that.

      As far as characters go, I'm not quite feeling it. Honestly Susie is the only interesting character so far, and I still feel like there were some missed opportunities related to her, though that mostly applies to gameplay stuff.

      Like, when I started doing battles with her, I was extremely excited, because I thought a recurring theme of the game was having to deal with a character that always attacks on her own while you're trying to go by fights peacefully, and I fucking loved the idea because it basically meant you had to befriend monsters in record time so you could spare them before Susie outright killed them. Aaaaaand it literally never came into play. I feel like the combat systems allows for way more interesting scenarios than ever came into play. Near the end of the thing, you have three characters on your party, but you're still sparing monsters within the same amount of turns, AND even leave most fights with a character who didn't even do anything. Like, there's a lot of potential in the party stuff, especially with the shared ACTions, and the fact that you have to spare monsters one by one. But the potential was never realized. This could be so much freaking better, but so far it feels like more of "omg itd be cool if undertale had a party of characters" instead of "How can we improve on Undertale's combat and make it more engaging".

      Buuuuuuuuuuut I'm guessing that's something they're going to improve on other chapters, as it relates more to the desing of the actual battles than the design of the battle system itself. I loved all the boss fight-type stuff for one, I just wish I loved more battles than just the bosses, haha.

      Most things I've said are complaints, but I actually loved this thing, haha. I really want to see where they're gonna go next!

      Also, the secret boss was fucking awesome, and I did beat it. It's really just a battle of endurance. Between Kris's ACTions to weaken him and Ralsei's healing, it can actually be pretty straightforward (but still fucking hard!).

      I really wasn't expecting this and it absolutely made my fucking day. I would've been massively satisfied with just this, but the fact that there's more coming is kind of amazing, haha.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Khao ().

    • My thoughts, calmed down:

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      The game seems to be an AU where the imprisonment of Monsters never happened, while they do live in a remote town, where Kris appears to be the only human.
      Evidence of this is:
      • Asriel is alive and college-aged.
      • Toriel and Asgore broke up after Asriel's death, so their divorce here would not fit a prequel.
      • Sans' place is Grillby's but with the "Grillby" part crossed out. This means that if this was a prequel, Grillby would have had to remove the "ans" part and repaint the "Grillby" part; seems far-fetched.
      Now, the ending is probably based off of this line from the First Human in the Bad Time run:
      "Let us erase this pointless world, and move on to the next."

      I thin'k the First Human has been hopping across universes somehow this way, maybe because of Kris' soul resonating with the Dark Fountain.


      The game is definitely an inferior sequel. Even if Lancer's theme is hella baller and the expectations-twisting humor is still top-notch.

      The "holy crap Toby thought of that" level feels lower (even though the dialogue shifts when you backtrack at certain points certainly do add charm). Might change as more of the game is discovered.
      The ACT menu feels less like a puzzle as there's very few options of which multiple can work.
      There's actually almost no reason to play pacifist. Enemies run when they're defeated, so there's no way of gaining EXP. Dialogue barely changes. King Round can't even be defeated with attacks because they heal themselves before you can do any serious damage.
      Jevil had like... no plot relation so far? Might change.

      That having been said, the graphics are a definite improvement. And I disagree with the characters being bad, I felt the same feelings there as in the first game. The king battle was a bit underwhelming but maybe the sequel will explain his proper motivation beyond his crazy final boss babbling.
    • I don't get the last post, about Toby being a goddamn genius. I mean, I know he IS, because Undertale was pure bottled magic, but don't get those images. I guess he had a concept of Lancer years ago, but... so?

      Deltarune was... fine. Not in the same league as Undertale. I felt a stirring of some of those same emotions, but it didn't grab me. OST is surprisingly disappointing, only one track I really liked (Field of Hopes and Dreams). Considering I still have about 15 of udnertale's tracks on my regular playlist, that's a big drop. I did enjoy it at least, and it has a lot of promise, especially in the new party-based combat, but it just wasn't as charming, heartfelt, aware, or reactive as Undertale was. Or as tragic. The promise didn't materialize.

      Display Spoiler
      Susie's story was resolved too quickly, we didn't have time to feel that character arc properly.
      Pronouns: He/Him

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Max N. ().

    • I guess he had a concept of Lancer years ago, but... so?

      He kept the project under wraps for six years, before he even started funds for Undertale.

      Considering he had no idea how big UT was gonna be, that's impressive.

      The promise didn't materialize.
      My guy, you seem to have made up the promise entirely that this was anywhere on the scope of Undertale 2.
      Toby calls the game a DEMO. A free one. And only the first chapter. If anything, and even that's a stretch considering the games want to accomplish different things, compare it to the ruins section of Undertale and nothing else.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by gamtos ().

    • gamtos wrote:

      My guy, you seem to have made up the promise entirely that this was anywhere on the scope of Undertale 2.
      I wasn't talking about scope, and I didn't make anything up. I was talking about quality. Obviously this was just a small chunk of something, maybe some episodic game or something. I think it took me 2.5 hours or so to play through. The first 2.5 hours of Undertale were better. More "charming, heartfelt, aware, reactive" and "tragic", as I said. And yes, that applies to just the first few hours of Undertale when compared to the first few hours of Deltarune.

      When I said the "promise didn't materialize", I was referring to the new combat system. The party-based nature seemed promising, but that promise never materialized - Toby didn't take advantage of it much. Maybe it will in the next release.

      All that said, "not as good as undertale" us hardly a fair bar to hold anything to, since Undertale was absolutely phenomenal. I did enjoy Deltarune, and I bought the soundtrack immediately because I thought he deserved money for it instead of just giving it away for free. Toby just didn't succeed at capturing the same lightning in the same bottle again with it, at least not yet in this current form.
      Pronouns: He/Him

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Max N. ().

    • I have to say, this song sounds like the intro to my ideal 2D Zelda game:

      Like I can picture it in my head practically, this song is so evocative. Many of Tobyfox's songs are.

      About the game itself, I enjoyed it a fair amount. It didn't tug at my emotions like I thought it would, but it caught my interest and made me very interested in what the final product will be, which I think was the intent. And it was really funny! Laughed a ton, just like Undertale.
    • I really enjoyed Delta Rune. It didn't hit the same notes as Undertale did, emotionally, but the humor was definitely there. It felt chunky for a demo, a single chapter that was it's own story! I will confess a tiny bit of disappointment in a lack of.. Adventure? Undertale was brimming with 'oh this place is weird, but its so cute!'

      The characters, overall, were pretty good. The music was, as expected, phenominal.

      Honestly, I got some like.. Early LoZ vibes from some of the music. If only Nintendo brought back the spirit of adventure and whimsey and love that games like Undertale and Delta Rune have!

      Anyway, at the end, I am SUPER excited for the continuing chapters. Toby is a genius, his team is fantastic and I can't wait for more.
    • Even for the tagline "your choices don't matter", I felt exploring, double-talking to people and backtracking was pretty rewarding.

      Aside from Jevil there was very little challenge in the battles. Even pacifist Undertale had some real challenge, but the balance in every other Deltarune battle was a joke.

      One cool mechanic is, proximity to "bullets" not only raises your TP, it also makes enemy attacks shorter.

      Anyone else feel this was even more Homestuck?

      The post was edited 1 time, last by gamtos ().

    • Hooooo boy, I am in love with this demo. So many thoughts, but I think I’ve pieced together the context of the full story after a few days of introspection. Spoilers be here, listing all key points in bullets.

      Display Spoiler

      • This is an AU set in 202X, ten years after the monsters' escape from the underground in 201X. However, causally it takes place before Undertale. Thanks, time travel! We know this because:
        • The thrashing machine blueprints were created in Deltarune.
        • The exact blueprints for the thrashing machine are in Sans’ secret room in Undertale.
        • Sans’ secret room contains a photo with three people Frisk does not recognize, along with the words “Don’t Forget”, a recurring phrase with Deltarune.
        • It seems pretty clear that Sans and the blueprints are the causal link to Undertale’s world. Somewhere along the line, the Sans from Deltarune will end up in Undertale’s world. That’s as far as the connection will go, I believe.
      • The Monster-Human war still happened. We know this because:
        • Asgore has the flowers.
        • Toriel is pissed at him.
        • Everyone from the underground is living together in a monster-only town, even if their specific lives are a bit different.

      • Kris is this AU’s Chara. They’re not posessed by Chara - they’re posessed by the player, you. And they want you the fuck out of their body. Because they’ve got people to murder.
      • Kris (obviously) never killed themself, the major difference between them and Chara.
      • Kris dresses just like Chara did.
      • Everyone is terrified of Kris, and Kris does some really creepy shit.
        • Sans will inform you that Toriel even locks her door at night.
      • People note that Kris looks sick, and is acting differently than usual while the player is in control of Kris's body.
      • The person speaking to the player during the character creation sequence is almost certainly Gaster, not Chara. We know this because:
        • The filenames for all of the heads, torsos, and legs contain “GONER” - the name for Gaster followers.
        • Gaster’s theme plays during the character creation segment.
        • Entering “Gaster” as a name during this section causes the game to reset.
      Thus, the Chara from Undertale is not in this game. The only characters from Undertale in Deltarune are Gaster and Sans.

      • Deltarune’s fourth wall-breaking twist is that it’s exploring the consequences of taking control of someone in the middle of their life.
      • The player is a very real soul in this case that is trying to take over Kris’s body.
      • This isn’t the first time this sort of intrusion has happened. We know this because of the description of the birdcage - that it’s seen a lot of crashes. And the bloodstain on the floor.
      • We don’t know how many times this has happened, or if it’s the same player taking over every time.
      • The opening sequence strongly resembles games like Chrono Trigger and Zelda, with the “protagonist” being awoken by their mother.
      • Pretty much everything that happens while we are in direct control of Kris’s body is a by-the-numbers JRPG trope.
      • The dark world was a hallucination caused by Gaster and the player’s soul inhabiting Kris to play a game.
      • It really happened, but it wasn’t real. It was more like a video game. Exactly like a video game, in fact. Think “The Pagemaster” with the exit sign and all.
      • Susie was able to see everything happening to Kris. Basically she just ended up as part of the game by accident. (She doesn’t know how she got the ax, but thinks it’s cool.)
      • The classroom layout is not just a coincidence, it’s what was used as the basis for the game. Literally every element from the game is present in the classroom.
      • The “Fountain” is just the light switch, which is why it “gives [the Dark] World form”. Flicking on the light switch is a sure way to get rid of the dark.
      • Ralsei, Lancer, and everyone else are figments of your presence and Gaster. If they do appear again, they might not remember us, or things might be strange about them.
      • The blueprints point to this being a real, physical phenomenon. Maybe gaster is connecting different AUs together to make the game happen? Or the blueprint wasn’t real and was a red herring the whole time, which means this could be a completely disconnected AU.
      • It becomes very clear that the very act of playing Deltarune means that you are physically hurting Kris and forcing him to go on an inane adventure with a purple dragon in a hallucinatory fantasy land where you talk to playing cards. No wonder he’s insane.
      • In the endgame, many characters reference interesting events happening “tomorrow” and invite you to come back. It’s a sure bet there is no tomorrow for Kris.
      • Kris is only in posession of his own body for a few hours each night.
      • Kris’s day is always reset - he will always wake up in his bed, posessed by a Gaster player, ad infinitum. Always the same day, always a game, until the player’s soul is tired enough to be ripped out.
      • Ralsei will remark in prison that Kris “looks like a prisoner for life”.
      • Kris is our prisoner - ours and Gaster’s. But he’s clearly dangerous otherwise. How long has this been going on for? Is Gaster trying to stop Kris, or is this all for fun and Kris is just collateral damage?

      I don’t know where the next chapters will go, but I’m very excited for the rest of this game. Really hope Toby is able to assemble his team and get it done in less than 7 years.